(Brought up again in discord prior to ‘big release’)
So.. you’re in a distance car race and you’re months ahead of any new racers catching you up in terms of distance. Even though your car will naturally slow down with age/wear and tear, you still have all the current best parts and technology.
You give those new guys the same car parts and technology that you have and they start off quicker than you did when you first joined the race with your crappy car. They will make up a bit of ground at first due to your slightly older car; but the reality is, they’ll never catch you up unless they receive something extra or you stop completely/breakdown 😉
So we discussed a bit today on discord about the possibility for a "noob bonus". I really hope the community can to try to take a step back and approach this idea from a new player perspective.
Joining an established game with players who have 10+ experience, especially a game as information heavy as this can be quite overwhelming.
That being said many argue that a new player joining will have the perks of learning from our knowledge. Where to train, what armor to use, as well as help with receiving better gear and the option to train with our general masters.
This is a great argument. This will definitely help any new player succeed in the game, but it doesn't take away from the disadvantage they will be at with their stats/evos. The original players will always be ahead in stats with no way for a new player to catch up. They will always feel behind because the fact is they are. I have already had a couple players come to me with this concern. I don't want new players avoiding faction events or not getting to enjoy the game to its full potential because they do not feel strong enough. Do we really think we will get a large new player base if we keep letting them feel that way?
I really think it is up to us to try and find a way for new players to be able to enjoy the game as much as us, and hopefully being able to feel that they can one day be able to compete at our level. I want nothing more than for a thriving community so that I can continue playing this game with all you amazing people for many years to come.
As for ideas:
Relics (We were all able to take advantage of relics while they were available in the market, now they are not.)
1. Maybe we can increase the quest rewards to x2 relics instead of 1 for new players.
2. A new player package of untradeable relics to kick start their evos/stats.
XP Bonus 1. Increase xp from quest rewards for new players. 2. Tiana mentioned an idea on discord.
a soft band aid solution could be to have a bonus exp for new players that decreases as your turns spent increases. starts super high, but the longer you play the more turns you use/skills you get the exp bonus slowly goes down over the weeks/months till its at zero
some great ideas , I like the double relic idea, I`ll add a little thought to the debate, in my opinion new player boosts arn`t a bad idea but I think having quests and interesting areas is more important, wether its a nice simple "go kill 20 Hapolops eating the towns cabbages" or a longer set of map crossing quests, the more the better they are a nice boost, and you can tweak them to give new players a bigger boost as well as helping with learning the dynamics of the game.
Setting the quests at varing skill levels keeping the "Older" players coming back to caps, (though it would be great to have plenty of random middle of nowhere quests too)
Hey, maybe as a new player I can weigh in on the debate!
I know the game is only 1 year old, so I might be too early with these comments, since Rangar seems to think about a more distant development stage of the game. But here I go: I agree with Kyri and Belouch; There are already good mechanisms in place that cause new players to progress quicker, while causing old players to slow down and if a solution needs to be installed for new players to progress quicker, the key lies in increasing the number of quests.
In light of this discussion, the ability to buy relics was probably a mistake (the mechanism itself favors characters further into the game, as they have better access to gold though the way evo's function did see to diminishing returns) but it has been solved. I've read a post of Dutch though that was spot on; having a universal reference value for gold (relics) was good for a stable economy. However, seeing how gold tends to concentrate in the hands of people with certain abilities, I'm very happy they've been deleted.
In my second day on Agonia, I got access to healing items, tier 2 armors and weapons. I also got access to a lot of resources to help me finish the seeking quests. I think these things are giving me a big advantage. There is also the knowledge, the forums, the guides. Right now I'm probably doing everything more efficiëntly than any one of you were able to do in the earliest months.
Some specific thoughts pertaining to the discussion;
the quests Hojeen gives are logically structured. Having quests with +25 main weapon skill requirement realizes that you almost reach the requirement of the next quest upon finishing the quest prior. So basically as a noob you can identify your early gaming goals like this, as you just need to grind for a few MW-levels after you finish a quest before you can start the next one. The problem with increasing a beginner xp boost is that it destroys this balanced progressive questing mechanism. However, I do feel like there is room (and a need) to have extra early game quests. I found out (just in time) that you need 60 seeking to start the gathering quests, and thus spend my second relic on that skill. I spend my first relic randomly on blacksmithing (being a noob and all). Having thus spend my second relic, I was able to do all these seeking quests while training from 130+ Main weapon skill to 150. I can imagine that this period for someone who wasn't as lucky as me, is less fun. Grinding is part of what makes a game fun - and I'm not saying that I want people to hold my hand always (though I like that too, Balin), but as a new player now, there are simply less goals to identify that give purpose to a MW-grind. Many items are freely available because of the factions, so there is no need to gather the materials that are present in the beginner area. More quests can fill this void, and flat exp rewards could ensure a quicker growth-path, which diminishes the gap between old players and new players. Right now the only 'side-quest' I have left is finding a snowshade. When I've done this, there will only be grinding to meet the criteria for Hojeen's next quest. Though I'd like to skill, there is little use, as I know my dear fellowship-members are willing to give me all items I might require (in this early/mid-stage). I feel like training my main skill is the only solid option atm. Questing (and their rewards) could increase the valid options I have, and can set (artificial) early goals for players that can replace the skilling goals that disappeared because of the logical development of the game. The rewards should be stuff like gold and general skill exp, it doesn't have to be much - but it gives a purpose while you are figgering out whether this game is for you. Working with soul-bound specific questing items would further ensure that I can't just grab all the required materials from a town, like I (partially -damn orobacle!) did with the seeking quests.
Here are my two cents heading into my second day in the game:
I think that so long as the turns regeneration is significantly increased (or gotten rid of entirely), new players who really want to catch up would be able to, as it would speed the game up. I love long-term games like this, but even so, speeding it up would be a boost to the entire community. And those who want to spend more time to train or skill up would be able to enjoy the benefits of such commitment.
As a new player I don't feel I need a boost at all, just get rid of the deep limitations of actions such as fighting/training/skilling/crafting, etc. I can understand a movement limit to add a layer of strategy in PVP, but the turns are really a way too limiting. I finish them up in minutes and have to wait hours to once again finish them up in minutes.
Guys I remind you that since many months now there is a noob bonus +30% XP for the first month, +15%XP for the second months. Deadladywalking reached softcap in less than 1 month, so new players can actually catch up very fast. Of course it will take a long time before they can 1vs1 the most elite players, but it should only take them 2-3 months before they can already play a significant role in group fights.